Beware of Scam: Pragmatic Leaders (YC W21) is a company that claims to offer a product management course with the promise of training and placement. However, many students, including myself as part of cohort 20, have been disappointed with their experience and have fallen victim to their pay-after-placement model.

Pros:

1. Access to experienced mentors in the field of product management.
2. Access to course content.
3. Opportunity to practice mock sessions with mentors through the Truemerit portal.

Cons:

1. Pragmatic Leaders charges a security fee of Rs. 35,000/- through a loan company. After a few days, the loan amount will be shown as Rs. 1.27 lakh, which needs to be paid in one go, not in EMI. Despite claiming that it's an EMI, it's not.
2. They expect students to apply for jobs through Naukri portal.
3. If a student is not selected by the 4-5 companies that Pragmatic Leaders refers them to, the company may terminate their association with a flimsy excuse and demand payment of the full amount, claiming that they have done their best and cannot help further.
4. They expect students to apply for jobs through Naukri portal.
5. If a student is not selected by the 4-5 companies that Pragmatic Leaders refers them to, the company may terminate their association with a flimsy excuse and demand payment of the full amount, claiming that they have done their best and cannot help further.

Explanation of the Initial Onboarding Process

1. Pragmatic Leaders will ask you to submit a refundable deposit of Rs.35,000.
2. This amount will be converted into a loan with their finance partner, which was previously Fibe and is now a different company.
3. After completing your 10 weeks of sessions, you will see that the balance due is Rs.1.28 lakh, which you need to pay in a single installment.
4. While on the call with the PL team, they may mention that you can pay in easy EMIs, but in reality, you have to pay the entire amount at once.

Training Period

1. After completing the 10-week program, you will receive reminders to finish your resume and portfolio.
2. Once you complete your assignments and submit your documents, you might not hear from the team anymore. If you do not initiate any contact, they will terminate your contract and send a legal notice asking you to pay the remaining amount of Rs.1.28 Lakh.
3. They might refer you to some companies, but it's not a guarantee. Even after the referral, they might still terminate your contract and ask for the remaining amount.
4. If you do not use their resources or get placed, they will still ask you to pay the remaining amount.
5. The "pay after placement" claim is a myth. It's a tactic to sell their 20k course for a fee of Rs.1.28 Lakh.
6. The course content is not very relevant, and better preparation material can be found on YouTube.
7. At some point during the course, they will ask you to sign a Non-Objection Certificate (NOC) on their truemerit portal. This document absolves them of any liability for placement or session quality issues. They also state that they will take legal action against you if you write a negative review.

They will use any possible means to terminate your enrollment, and the information displayed on their website is completely fraudulent. Many students have fallen into their trap, with only 1 out of 20 students in their batch actually getting placed, and 98% of students getting terminated. Getting a refund is also unlikely, as they often claim that the negative reviews are fake and refuse to provide any refunds.

It is highly recommended to read reviews on Quora and other websites, and consult with people on LinkedIn before enrolling in their program. If you still decide to proceed, please do so at your own risk as you may easily fall into their trap.

In the event that you dispute the termination and try to communicate with them via email, they may respond with a message similar to the following:

"When you enrolled in our program, you signed an agreement between yourself and PL. The academic fee for the program was INR 2,70,000, which is divided into two parts: tuition fee and placement fee. The tuition fee, which includes the refundable deposit of INR 36,500 and the training fee of INR 1,28,500, was paid by our financial partner to PL for the academic phase."

The details regarding the Tuition Fee are mentioned in the agreement under clause 2f. As per the agreement, upon completion of 10 weeks in the program, the learner is required to pay the Tuition Fee of INR 1,28,500 for the Mentor services used, in addition to the Refundable Deposit. The Tuition Fee must be paid in full and can be paid through the ES app before the due date mentioned on the app to avoid any late payment charges.

It's important to note that the financial loan issued by ES is directly linked to the agreement tenure with PL. The duration of the agreement with PL corresponds with the loan agreement tenure with ES. The ES system automatically calculates the loan closure date based on the agreement tenure. For example, if the program started on 19th February 2022, then the loan closure date would be 19th December 2022, which is 10 months from the start date.

How can those responsible for such deceitfulness even stomach their food or close their eyes at night, knowing the immense pain and suffering they have caused to innocent students?

It's a shame that a course like this even exists, preying on vulnerable individuals who are seeking to better their careers. Your actions are nothing short of despicable and immoral. How can you sleep at night knowing that you are taking advantage of people's dreams and aspirations?

I implore you to take a hard look in the mirror and face the full weight of your guilt, for committing countless sins that will haunt you for eternity.

Your fake paid reviews may fool some, but those of us who have been burned by your course know the truth. You are nothing but a money-hungry scam artist, preying on the hopes and dreams of innocent people.

It's clear that you have no interest in actually helping your students succeed. Your only concern is lining your pockets with their hard-earned money. Shame on you.

The fact that you have to resort to posting fake reviews shows just how little faith you have in the quality of your course. If it was truly a valuable and worthwhile investment, your satisfied students would be singing your praises without any need for incentivized reviews.

PL team confess your wrongdoing and beg for forgiveness from the students you have wronged. You owe them that much, and more. It is time for you to make amends and rectify your mistakes. Until then, you will remain a blight on the educational landscape, a symbol of everything that is wrong with the world.

You claim to have alumni, but there is no evidence of any student sharing their learning process or what they have gained from your so-called course. The lack of genuine testimonials only proves that your alumni are fake, and your entire enterprise is nothing but a scam.

Your course materials are of poor quality, and your intentions are nefarious. You continue to trap students with your complicated contracts and extort money from them. It is time for you to acknowledge your bad intentions and confess to your heinous deeds.

Your deceitful and shameful actions have caused irreparable damage to the lives and dreams of countless students who trusted you with their hard-earned money and future aspirations.

Writing it with deep remorse and utter abhorrence that hundreds of students must be feeling for the atrocious act that you have committed. Your actions have not only shattered their dreams of a better future but have also left them with a deep sense of pain and anguish.

It is heart-wrenching to think that you have betrayed the trust of so many students who put their faith in you. You have taken advantage of their vulnerability, their eagerness to learn and grow, and their hard-earned money. And all for what? Your own selfish motives?

The gravity of your wrongdoing cannot be overstated. You have not only robbed students of their money, but you have also robbed them of their time, their effort, and their hopes for a better future. You have inflicted deep wounds on their minds and souls that may take a long time to heal.

It is hard to comprehend how you could justify such deceitful behavior. How could you sleep at night knowing that you have misled, deceived, and cheated so many students? How could you have the audacity to post fake paid reviews to lure in more unsuspecting victims?

Your actions have brought shame to your community and to the field of education. You have tainted the reputation of genuine educators who strive to make a positive impact on their students' lives. And for what? A quick buck?

I implore you to reflect on the pain that you have inflicted on so many innocent students. I implore you to realize the gravity of your wrongdoing and to take responsibility for your actions. Only then can you begin to make amends for the harm that you have caused.

I hope that anyone who reads this review learns from the pain that hundreds of students have had to endure. I hope that they see the importance of doing thorough research and making informed decisions when it comes to investing their time, effort, and money into their education.

No amount of deceit or cover-up can escape the watchful eye of the Almighty, and the reckoning for these heinous acts will surely come, sooner or later.

The placement rate is less than 20% in the last few cohorts, not a single person in cohort 27 got placement or any related support, yet everyone was extorted to pay Rs 1,60,000 because of the loan agreement they signed.
They don't have to pay back if they fail to place you because the loan is your name, and they file cases and send goons to your home against you if you don't pay up.
They have hijacked the Trustpilot review system, don't trust the positive reviews there.
https://pdfhost.io/v/KKF8kz9To_TrustPilot_fake_reviews

It is imperative that potential customers be aware of the company's deceitful tactics and "buy now, pay later" schemes.

It is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to their deceitful and unethical business practices.

A word to the wise: be afraid of the repercussions, be afraid of the creator's wrath.

PL, a true representation of the term "scam" in the realm of edtech. They have built their business model on preying on individuals' aspirations, resulting in nothing but wasted time, effort, and hard-earned money.

They assign students with pointless case studies, leaving them ungraded for months. When questioned about this, they produce fabricated report cards in an attempt to cover up their own shortcomings.

Students should not expect any support or guidance from them, even in cases where they have secured job opportunities through their own referrals and need assistance with case studies or interviews. The company's own so called "mentors" are ill-equipped/incapable to provide such guidance.

They fail to provide one-on-one assistance with resume and portfolio building, which should have been done within the first month of enrollment. Instead, they engage in months-long email exchanges for even the most minor issues and consistently cancel scheduled meetings at the last minute. Even if a student's resume is approved somehow, according to their own laid out criteria, it is unlikely to result in any job offers even from the subpar companies brought in for placements. They don't have any relationship with any company. All the jobs are taken from Linkedin which you can easily apply by yourself. You'll be fooled that you are not putting that much efforts required that's why not getting shortlisted. But the truth is, it is their failure not yours because even they are not able to figure out why it is happening. Only blame game continues to expel you out and swallow your hard earned money.

The company closed their Slack channel after facing overwhelming criticism from current students regarding their refusal to refund fees. Don't let yourself be duped by them, as they have opened the channel again. Screenshots of all previous conversations are available as evidence. Just try contacting previous cohort members.

The company entices students to take out loans from NBFCs with cleverly crafted terms and conditions, only to ultimately force them to exit their courses due to their inability to place anyone in any of the cohorts. This pattern repeats across all cohorts, leaving everyone deceived.

They fail to respond to emails or messages on any channel, instead opting to cover up their shortcomings with carefully crafted responses. If they had put this level of effort into actually delivering on their promises, the company may have seen true success. Additionally, they have now resorted to paying for fake reviews to boost their image. A quick check of the reviewers' LinkedIn profiles will reveal the truth. If still unsure, just have a one-to-one session with these people who have put these paid positive reviews. Let us know if they are for real.

The quality of material provided by them is subpar, with much better resources readily available for free on platforms such as YouTube and LinkedIn. Furthermore, it has come to light that the company's so-called chief sages have been expelled from the previous organization, further calling into question their credibility. Just do a little search, you'll get it.

Scheduled meetings are consistently canceled at the last minute, suggesting communication via email, WhatsApp, or Slack instead. However, even these methods of communication often go ignored for months.

The company's supposed mentors/instructors are unresponsive to requests for guidance, as they themselves lack the knowledge and expertise to assist with case studies and interviews.

Customers are left in a difficult situation, forced to pay or risk damage to their credit scores and harassment from collection agents from the NBFCs.

The company has no legitimate physical address, making it impossible to send them any inquiries or notices. If they do receive such correspondence via email, they respond with defamation notices.

They are nothing more than a snake oil salesman, preying on the aspirations of their students and leaving them with nothing but empty promises and wasted time, effort, and money.

To students, Beware of the wolf in sheep's clothing, for God is watching everything.

And for the sages, May the Lord have mercy on your souls, for your time of reckoning is near.

I am sharing my experience with Pragmetic Leaders about their Pay after placement program for Product Managment

How is let me explain it to you

Initial Onboarding process & explanation
1) They will ask you to submit a refundable deposit of Rs.35,000/-
2) They will convert that amount to a loan with their finance partner and it will open up your credit limit of Rs.1.28 Lack
3) Once you complete your 10 weeks of sessions in your finance(Loan) account you will see that the balance due it will show is Rs. 1.28 Lack which you need to pay as a one-time fee (But as per the agreement they will say you need to give it in EMI)
4)PL team will say that you will with easy EMI, not the one-time payment but it's false.

During training
1) Once the 10-week program will over they will send some timely emails to complete your resume and portfolio, that's it nothing else apart from that. Doesn't matter if you complete it or not they will send saying that we have reminded you and you haven't done it, its not our fault. No one will come and even ask you a single time or for personal support.

2)Once you complete that and all their assignment here you will be finding almost no communication with the team, and if you haven't contacted them they will terminate you and send you a legal notice to pay Rs1.28 Lack

3) If you complete these things and after some time they might refer you to a few companies( usually they will not) and after that also they will terminate you and ask for the Rs.1.28 Lack to pay (Basically their finance partner will make pressure on you, not PL)

4) If you are not using their resource or nor got placed or nor taken any PM or any other placement as well they will ask the money
5) Its a myth that they say pay after placement, it's a way how to sell the 20k course on a fee of Rs.1.28L
6) The course content you will not find very relevant and you can find better content on youtube for the interview preparation
7) In the middle of the course they will ask you to sign a NOC which says that you will not raise a voice against them if anything goes wrong in terms of placement and session we are not liable and you mention any bad review also we at PL will take legal action against you

They will terminate you and will find almost every possible way to terminate you.

The data shown on the website is 200% fake and multiple students are getting into their trap, only 1 out of 20 students in their batch get placement and 98% of the students they use to terminate and hardly any candidate got the refund if not placed, They will say that we will share the report card for you, you are posting a fake review on another website.

Read reviews on quora and other websites and consult people on social media you will find many fraud cases. IF YOU WANT TO GO AHEAD GO AT YOUR OWN RISK BUT YOU WILL DEFINITELY BE IN THIS TRAP

You will fight with them on email for the same and after some time they will message you something like this

"The Academic Fee is charged for learners in the program. When you enrolled in the program, an agreement was signed between you and PL.

The Fee of the program was INR 2,70,000
It is divided into 2 parts
1. The Tuition Fee - which is INR 1,65,000 (which included the RD amount of INR 36,500 plus the Training amount of INR 1,28,500)
2. Placement Fee
As with any other institute, the Financial partner paid the Tuition fee to PL for the Academic phase which was INR 1,28,500 + 36,500.

All this is explained in the agreement. Please refer to the table under clause 2f. It is mentioned in the agreement when you spend 10 weeks in the program, you are liable to pay the Tuition Fee. The Tuition Fee is INR 1,28,500 for the Mentor services used. This Tuition fee has to be paid in one go and can be paid on the finance partner app itself. And, the fee needs to be paid before the due date shown on the partner app, to avoid any late payment charges.

Please note, the financial loan issued by the finance partner is directly related to your agreement tenure. To explain: The duration of your agreement with PL is directly related to your loan agreement tenure.
Their system takes your agreement date for the loan closure also.

Also, this company does not have any registered office anywhere, If you want to check try to send any draft it will come back, they will claim that the office is in Gurugram, but no office address you will be able to find.

If you will ask for the address you might get it if you are enrolling for the course but I am sure that the address will not be legit

As a revert they will say that we are not victims, we don't do anything they will sound like it's not our fault blah blah, It's your decision if you want to go in this trap ahead.

SCAM & FRAUD
Pragmatic Leaders; surviving like a parasite by playing with people's aspirations.

Wasting not just time, efforts & people's hard earned money but also lost trust, respect and faith among people.

1. They make u take a loan from NBFC with well crafted T&C and at the end force you to exit the course because they can't place anyone in any of the Cohort. Story is same for all Cohorts, all are cheated.

2. No one listens and replies to mails & messages on any channel. Just trying to curtain things on every platform with well crafted answers. If you guys would have used this creativity in real cause, your company would have grown leaps & bounds.

3. Worst Quality of material. Much better material is available on Youtube & Linkedin for free.

4. They make you solve useless case studies and won't rate them for months. When u question them, they'll bring out report cards made up by them to cover up their failure.

5. They won't help u to finalize resume & portfolio on one to one basis, which should have been done within first month itself. They only pass the time by exchanging mails for months even for minor things. Even if you try to schedule meeting, it'll get cancelled at last minute each & everytime for everyone. Even if you somehow get your resume approved as per their criteria, you won't get any shortlist from any of the sub standard companies they bring in. Forget the placement.

6. Don't expect anything, even in a case, if u've got some opprtunity from ur own referral & need guidance & support for case studies & interviews. Because even they don't know how to crack those interviews. Been there and faced that.

7. Scheduled meeting gets cancelled at the eleventh hour with a reply on mail to connect via email/whatsapp/slack. But there also, you won't receive any reply for months even after requesting multiple times from so called self proclaimed mentors.

8. They closed their slack channel after they started facing huge criticism from existing students for repaying back the fees.

9. None of their so called mentors reply to your mails and messages for guidance because even they don't know how to solve the case studies.

10. You'll be stucked in middle of a situation where u'll have to pay else your cibil will be badly hit and will be followed by collection agents of NBFC.

Always remember, Karma will get back at you, Sooner or later it surely will.